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Oktoberfest Event 2022 Feedback

Al35ul CM

Shadow City Guardian
Former Team Member
thanks InnoGames.. set was good for me now its worst and im dueler class
the duel set is crap, go back to how it was, please
I don't know why you give sets out and than alter them on people opinion! You totaly ruined duel set, because of that! I was looking forward to this event, as it had decent duel set and off set, but now both are crap (duel set more than off), i'll probably just pass this event.
The changes were requested by a large portion of our players that provided feedback on the sets, and thus it has been nerfed.
 

FreeHugs

Private
I also complained at first but I was wrong and did not know how low the stats were at first because of how the skills were presented (my own fault, usually I wait till I can test in game or see in TW-Calc as it's easier to see the stats), I simply saw that it had 5 different strong skills, not the amount of each skill.

Is it too late to change anything further?
 

Warbird78

Reservist
The changes were requested by a large portion of our players that provided feedback on the sets, and thus it has been nerfed.
I don't get it, why you even give it out to public before it's out?! You'll always get stronger oposition than position in deff duel sets, because duelers will start complaining, because it'll make their life little tougher, and most of "population" just doesn't care or know enough about dueling to give feedback! Same goes with off set, tanks will be oposite, same as damagers are when implementing deff set and you'll never please everyone, there's no way in that! Instead of getting 2 good sets and 1 decent set, we're getting 1 good set (speed), 1 decent set(dmg) and total 1 crap set.
 

Al35ul CM

Shadow City Guardian
Former Team Member
I also complained at first but I was wrong and did not know how low the stats were at first because of how the skills were presented (my own fault, usually I wait till I can test in game or see in TW-Calc as it's easier to see the stats), I simply saw that it had 5 different strong skills, not the amount of each skill.

Is it too late to change anything further?
It is indeed :(.

I don't get it, why you even give it out to public before it's out?! You'll always get stronger oposition than position in deff duel sets, because duelers will start complaining, because it'll make their life little tougher, and most of "population" just doesn't care or know enough about dueling to give feedback! Same goes with off set, tanks will be oposite, same as damagers are when implementing deff set and you'll never please everyone, there's no way in that! Instead of getting 2 good sets and 1 decent set, we're getting 1 good set (speed), 1 decent set(dmg) and total 1 crap set.
This process that we have has been requested by players thus it has been provided. Please keep in mind that it is a place for feedback (not just to provide requests to nerf sets) and we count on players' feedback to improve, nerf and/or keep the sets as they are.
 

Warbird78

Reservist
It is indeed :(.


This process that we have has been requested by players thus it has been provided. Please keep in mind that it is a place for feedback (not just to provide requests to nerf sets) and we count on players' feedback to improve, nerf and/or keep the sets as they are.
Well, how do you decide who you'll listen to? I bet 75% of people playing servers doesn't even know beta exists and or don't care about discussing things here *as didn't i until now*, because they trust stuff and developers. Also many got info what's coming in event and got excited and started making plans, now they're dissapointed.

And as you can see, people that'll reply will mostly complain and that's not general opinion, because those that're happy with sets won't write it and you don't have any poll or anything, so your opinion is purely on those who didn't like sets and you have no idea if they're minority or majority of population, you just have impression most are against, because only those against will ever post, because people like to complain *like i'm doing now* ;)
 

ChickenMcGuy

Tombstone Sole Survivor
The West Team
Well, how do you decide who you'll listen to? I bet 75% of people playing servers doesn't even know beta exists and or don't care about discussing things here *as didn't i until now*, because they trust stuff and developers. Also many got info what's coming in event and got excited and started making plans, now they're dissapointed.

And as you can see, people that'll reply will mostly complain and that's not general opinion, because those that're happy with sets won't write it and you don't have any poll or anything, so your opinion is purely on those who didn't like sets and you have no idea if they're minority or majority of population, you just have impression most are against, because only those against will ever post, because people like to complain *like i'm doing now* ;)

We are open to constructive changes from players' feedback. We will consider making some changes in the form of asking for feedback from players in the future.
 

WhyN0t

Staff Sergeant
The changes were requested by a large portion of our players that provided feedback
This is true. I'm glad you listened. But the feedback wasn't that good in this case. As I pointed out from the beginning, the problem is given by the exaggerated bonus of the soldier, not by the bonus of this set. You can get similar (even better) bonuses from certain combinations of items from shops (i attached a prinscreen few comments above) which everyone can buy and upgrade up to ^5 if they want.
Most people also complained about the useless bonus of adventurer and broken soldier bonus in duel, i'm still waiting for buff/nerf.
 

WhyN0t

Staff Sergeant
The problem is that most players don't spend enough time on the game to understand it exhaustively. So their opinion would be uninformed and almost irrelevant. Another problem is that people by nature are subjective. Many only propose what directly concerns them, without having an overview of the game and without putting themselves in the other person's shoes. For example, there are duelists who propose better and better items on damagers, even though the damagers are clearly at an advantage over tanks at the moment. They want worst set for tanks and stronger for damagers. Because they are duelist and of course this is what they want, even if this will ruin the balance. There are still people who have no idea about the game and persistently propose a ridiculous idea, which at some point ends up being implemented. I'm talking here about the reflex appearance set proposed on Facebook by an individual. 0 arguments, 0 explanations, just a ridiculous proposal, inexplicably implemented. There are others who are only passionate about one thing (example: adventures, dueling etc.) and want sets just for that, not caring about the job/fort sets at all. They simply don't care about the rest and make dumb proposals. There are also some who already have upgraded sets and don't want to see good new ones, because they should buy/upgrade them and don't want to. They don't think as a whole and are individualistic, they only think about themselves. There are others at the opposite pole, who want better and better sets at each event, which would clearly worsen power creep. Although making useless sets is not good either. You want a new trade set, but find Revere already very good? Simple. Make it weaker in terms of money and luck boost, but give it more points, the existing diminishing returns should be enough that those points don't make a big difference, but enough that many will buy it. Boswell's clothes and horse+saddle don't offer enough work points. You could have introduced some weapons similar to Revere's horse and saddle, the existing trade weapons are very weak. Even the nugget exclusive ones seem weak to me. People's opinions will always be divided, most being too subjective or uninformed, even more so when it comes to some event sets, obviously everyone wants what he needs (in the case of duelists, weaker sets for tanks and better for damagers, in the case of tanks vice versa). In the case of a soldier a set with as much tactics as possible, in the case of another duel based class a set of t/r or appearance. For those who already have lucille/chef's weapons for adventures, new battle rifles as weak as possible for adventures, for those who don't, increasingly better rifles. It's normal to have this division, you guys need to look at the big picture and balance. However, when it comes to general feedback about the game, about the insistent requests that have been coming for years asking you to balance character classes, especially the adventurer whose bonus has been obsolete for years, or feedback about PvP in general, asking for better rewards to encourage it (as that's what keeps the game alive), this feedback should be listened to. Although it's clear that it's not happening. I'm afraid the big level 180 update won't bring any changes to PvP or class bonuses. You buffed the worker a few years ago, is it so hard to do it with the adventurer or soldier (in this case a nerf to duel bonus)?
As a conclusion, you cannot and should not please everyone. You should have someone knowledgeable to help you (or make) the sets. To think about the possible combinations (especially when it comes to the duel), not just the set as a whole and keep in mind the (fragile) balance that must exist. The formulas in this game are old, you need to be careful when introducing new items.
PS: I hope you will pay attention to the skills that have not diminishing returns when you introduce the increased level. And yes, I'm referring to fort's leadership for those who have hp at minimum.
 

WhyN0t

Staff Sergeant
This is also true, the way they show bonuses is weird. Usually in different ways, last time we only saw the individual set bonus for x number of items, not full set bonu.. It should be similar with the way bonuses are displayed on tw-calc or wikies.
 
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BaggyBlue

Master Sergeant
@WhyN0t in the Wiki it may no longer be displayed! The reason is that what is harvested on the set.

Why my suggestion? What we do 1 week to test has nothing to do with beta testing. Real testing is like the name Bingo test and then comment so called you have to fill out question arcs. This is called testing.

Example for Valentien Event comes the product in January and there is tested and then you give the comments about the product. Not in the forum reading the formula and so say the boarding or that. But it makes only about 10 players with okay 9 of the Baggy gives only the mustard there to
 

lulumcnoob

Master Sergeant
Former Team Member
No offence BaggyBlue but it's very difficult to understand what you just said. We can ask for temporary wiki pages with the sets in the future for a better understanding.
I think he's echoing the sentiment that we don't actually have enough time or resources to test anything on the supposed test server before it's too late to change anything.
It has become obvious that the set designers don't have a deep and complete understanding of the game's mechanics, and rely on (inconsistent) player feedback, but it's difficult to assume how a new set will affect PvP gameplay without actually playing with it, which is what we are asked to do, which is contrary to how we have tested updates in the past with the Elite Testers, who were given the proper time and resources to complete assigned tasks relating to testing the update in exchange for nuggets.

Finding a better way to display the set's stats would not go far in allowing the Beta players to provide better and timely feedback - we need to actually play with the new gear if it is to be properly tested and balanced because there's an absurd amount of skill points in play that the old formulae can't handle properly.

And on that note, I wonder how long we will get to "test" the level cap update before it's forced upon innocent production worlds.
 
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BaggyBlue

Master Sergeant
I think he's echoing the sentiment that we don't actually have enough time or resources to test anything on the supposed test server before it's too late to change anything.
It has become obvious that the set designers don't have a deep and complete understanding of the game's mechanics, and rely on (inconsistent) player feedback, but it's difficult to assume how a new set will affect PvP gameplay without actually playing with it, which is what we are asked to do, which is contrary to how we have tested updates in the past with the Elite Testers, who were given the proper time and resources to complete assigned tasks relating to testing the update in exchange for nuggets.

Finding a better way to display the set's stats would not go far in allowing the Beta players to provide better and timely feedback - we need to actually play with the new gear if it is to be properly tested and balanced because there's an absurd amount of skill points in play that the old formulae can't handle properly.

And on that note, I wonder how long we will get to "test" the level cap update before it's forced upon innocent production worlds.
:up:
 

Immortalmadguys

Reservist
We are open to constructive changes from players' feedback. We will consider making some changes in the form of asking for feedback from players in the future.
Hey Mate
it's really good that we can see you Said you are open to constructive Changes
I've One question
Why you do not NERF UNION OFFICER?
as much as I can see that set ruins FF balance
and after 3 years it's time to correct it
Yours IMG
 

-peyman-

Reservist
Below you can find the changed and final bonuses

ItemItem BonusItemsBonus CumulatedBonus Step by step
Hat+0.04 Dexterity(per Level)
+0.05 Charisma (per Level)
+0.35 Aiming (per Level)
+0.4 Setting traps(per Level)
+0.45 Leadership (per Level)
1
Scarf+0.05 Dexterity(per Level)
+0.04 Charisma (per Level)
+0.25 Aiming (per Level)
+0.5 Setting traps(per Level)
+0.42 Leadership (per Level)
2+0.03 Dexterity(per Level)
+0.035 Charisma (per Level)
+0.1 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.05 Aiming (per Level)
+0.15 Leadership (per Level)
+0.500000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
Coat+0.08 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.08 Charisma (per Level)
+0.36 Aiming (per Level)
+0.5 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.45 Leadership (per Level)
3+0.04 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.055 Charisma (per Level)
+0.2 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.15 Aiming (per Level)
+0.35 Leadership (per Level)
+1.500000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
+0.01 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.02 Charisma (per Level)
+0.1 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.1 Aiming (per Level)
+0.15 Leadership (per Level)
+1.000000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
Pants+0.08 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.08 Charisma (per Level)
+0.5 Aiming (per Level)
+0.6 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.62 Leadership (per Level)
4+0.055 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.08 Charisma (per Level)
+0.4 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.25 Aiming (per Level)
+0.6 Leadership (per Level)
+2.500000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
+0.015 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.025 Charisma (per Level)
+0.2 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.1 Aiming (per Level)
+0.23 Leadership (per Level)
+1.000000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
Belt+0.06 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.07 Charisma (per Level)
+0.36 Aiming (per Level)
+0.36 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.45 Leadership (per Level)
5+0.075 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.11 Charisma (per Level)
+0.5 Setting traps (per Level)
+0,45 Aiming (per Level)
+0.9 Leadership (per Level)
+4.00000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
+0.02 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.03 Charisma (per Level)
+0.1 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.2 Aiming (per Level)
+0.25 Leadership (per Level)
+1.500000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
Shoes+0.06 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.06 Charisma (per Level)
+0.36 Aiming (per Level)
+0.5 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.5 Leadership (per Level)
6+0.105 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.15 Charisma (per Level)
+0.7 Setting traps (per Level)
+0,65 Aiming (per Level)
+1.03 Leadership (per Level)
+6.00000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)
+0.03 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.04 Charisma (per Level)
+0.2 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.2 Aiming (per Level)
+0.25 Leadership (per Level)
+2.00000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)

Weapons
RangeDamage: 15-25
+1.1 Damage (per Level)
+0.04 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.05 Charisma (per Level)
+0.3 Aiming (per Level)
+0.4 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.46 Leadership (per Level)
MeleeDamage: 15-25
+1.1 Damage (per Level)
+0.04 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.05 Charisma (per Level)
+0.3 Aiming (per Level)
+0.4 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.46 Leadership (per Level)
RifleDamage: 25-45
+2.1 Damage (per Level)
+0.09 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.09 Charisma (per Level)
+0.36 Aiming (per Level)
+0.5 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.46 Leadership (per Level)
For wearing 2 items:

+0.03 Dexterity (per Level)
+0.05 Charisma (per Level)
+0.4 Setting traps (per Level)
+0.4 Aiming (per Level)
+0.46 Leadership (per Level)
+4.500000 Multiplayer Attack (Fort battle bonus)

ItemItem BonusItemsBonus CumulatedBonus Step by step
Hat+ 0.02 Strength (per level)
+0.42 Vigor (per level)
+0.42 Health points (per level)
+0.42 Aiming (per level)
+0.4 Tactics (per level)
1
Scarf+0.02 Mobility (per level)
+0.03 Charisma (per level)
+0.25 Vigor (per level)
+0.3 Dodging (per level)
+0.3 Tactics (per level)
2+0,02 Strength (per level)
+0,02 Charisma (per level)
+0,15 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Vigor (per level)
Coat+0.025 Strength (per level)
+0.025 Mobility (per level)
+0.4 Vigor (per level)
+0.3 Dodging (per level)
+0.3 Aiming (per level)
+0.42 Tactics (per level)
3+0,02 Strength (per level)
+0,02 Mobility (per level)
+0,04 Charisma (per level)
+0,2 Vigor (per level)
+0,43 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Aiming (per level)
+0,2 Health points (per level)
+0,02 Mobility (per level)
+0,02 Charisma (per level)
+0,28 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Aiming (per level)
+0,2 Health points (per level)
Pants+0.04 Strength (per level)
+0.03 Mobility (per level)
+0.4 Tactics (per level)
+0.4 Vigor (per level)
+0.2 Health points (per level)
+0.2 Dodging (per level)
4+0,01 Strength (per level)
+0,02 Mobility (per level)
+0,06 Charisma (per level)
+0,4 Vigor (per level)
+0,15 Dodging (per level)
+0,43 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Aiming (per level)
+0,35 Health points (per level)
+0,01 Strength (per level)
+0,02 Charisma (per level)
+0,2 Vigor (per level)
+0,15 Dodging (per level)
+0,15 Health points (per level)
Belt+0.04 Strength (per level)
+0.02 Mobility (per level)
+0.04 Charisma (per level)
+0.37 Tactics (per level)
+0.3 Vigor (per level)
+0.3 Dodging (per level)
5+0,02 Strength (per level)
+0,03 Mobility (per level)
+0,01 Dexterity (per level)
+0,08 Charisma (per level)
+0,5 Vigor (per level)
+0,15 Dodging (per level)
+0,6 Tactics (per level)
+0,35 Aiming (per level)
+0,5 Health points (per level)
+0,01 Strength (per level)
+0,01 Mobility (per level)
+0,01 Dexterity (per level)
+0,02 Charisma (per level)
+0,17 Tactics (per level)
+0,1 Vigor (per level)
+0,15 Aiming (per level)
+0,15 Health points (per level)
Shoes+0.035 Strength (per level)
+0.035 Mobility (per level)
+0.035 Charisma (per level)
+0.3 Vigor (per level)
+0.4 Aiming (per level)
+0.35 Tactics (per level)
6+0,035 Strength (per level)
+0,045 Mobility (per level)
+0,025 Dexterity (per level)
+0,095 Charisma (per level)
+0,7 Vigor (per level)
+0,3 Dodging (per level)
+0,8 Tactics (per level)
+0,5 Aiming (per level)
+0,7 Health points (per level)
+0,015 Strength (per level)
+0,015 Mobility (per level)
+0,015 Dexterity (per level)
+0,015 Charisma (per level)
+0,2 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Vigor (per level)
+0,15 Aiming (per level)
+0,15 Dodging (per level)
+0,2 Health points (per level)

Weapons

Melee+1.27 Damage (per Level)
+0.025 Strength (per level)
+0.02 Mobility (per level)
+0.02 Charisma (per level)
+0.3 Vigor (per level)
+0.25 Health points (per level)
+0.28 Tactics (per level)
Range+1.27 Damage (per Level)
+0.025 Strength (per level)
+0.02 Mobility (per level)
+0.02 Charisma (per level)
+0.25 Health points (per level)
+0.3 Shooting (per level)
+0.28 Tactics (per level)
Rifle+2.21 Damage (per Level)
+0.03 Strength (per Level)
+0.025 Mobility (per Level)
+0.03 Charisma (per Level)
+0.3 Vigor (per level)
+0.3 Health points (per level)
+0.3 Aiming (per level)
+0.28 Tactics (per level)
For wearing 2 items:

+0,03 Strength (per level)
+0,02 Mobility (per level)
+0,01 Dexterity (per level)
+0,02 Charisma (per level)
+0,3 Tactics (per level)
+0,2 Vigor (per level)
+0,2 Aiming (per level)
+0,2 Dodging (per level)
+0,2 Health points (per level)

no fair!

After three years of spending Cash and time we saw a good set for defense Damagers and suddenly you killed our motivation for game
you want to motivate players or what?
every time we spend lot of $ to level up gears (first Phoebe then Ron's and now this john astor ) to get only 5 % closer to that Union set
we can see people who bought union didn't/don't/won't Need spend a dime not for Attack gear nor for defense
if you nerfed John Asotr so nerf union too or at least sell it again in worlds you sold once
 
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